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Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America Certified Roof Cleaning Specialist

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Date: Sep 21, 2012
RE: New Member
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First off, I'm sorry we got off to a bad start. In my own nasty way [and I am not a sweet guy, I'm afraid] I am trying to help you get away from your long drawn out 3 part process of cleaning roofs with a pitch witch. Looks like you spend more time with any one part, than I do with a whole roof!

2nd, I was wrong about the flat surface cleaner from Home Depot, after looking more closely, all I see is the 4 wheeled pitch witch.

Now, you didn't answer my questions. You said you use the spider to rinse, but your video and photos show that you rinse with a garden hose. So part 2 is where you clean the roof with the homemade pitch witch. Why do you say it's for rinsing?

Of course, lots of pressure washing guys [ I am a pressure washing company too-not just softwash roof cleaning ] use a pitch witch to clean roofs, I think having the extra 2 wheels is a good innovation on the Pitch Witch though!

That homemade spider is most certainly nothing but a pitch witch, just with 4 wheels.

You keep saying you fall under certain of the 50 point standards.

You are cleaning roofs with a witch, plain and simple [ we are roof cleaners, we know what we are looking at ] That is not our method of cleaning roofs. If folks like you can come here, unfamiliar with our actual cleaning process and read those 50 points [which I was opposed to ever having-personally] Then they need to be rewritten.

What my video and all the other RCIA roof cleaners videos show, is the RCIA method--period. My "sales pitch" is "based" on the ARMA Bulletin in part.

That bulletin is for do it yourself homeowners. As professionals, we use that as a guide and set our mixture according to a roofs needs. They say up to 2 1/2 bleach and 2 1/2 water & TSP. "Assuming" that the ARMA is talking about household bleach and not pool chlorine- that a 50% mix for shingled roofs. The math is household bleach 5%. We use pool chlorine [both sodium hypochlorite] All my pool stores sell 10% SH and for shingles, I mix it 1/3 or less SH and the rest water-adding only a surfactant/soap to thicken the mix, so it doesn't run right off the roof. So, figure it out, how much stronger is my SH solution, than the ARMA household bleach solution? Plus, mine is in the hands of an expert, not a homeowner.

You asked "I like your video, but doesn't that solution/spray become slippery when you are walking directly on it? Especially
when it is shown from the side view in the end. Looks steep from the side view."

I am 64 and have never slipped off a roof in my 23 years in this business. I have 1/3rd the chance of falling, as your crew has, I am only on it 1 time, not 3. { Remember, I am not being a smart azz, I talk to the point. Everyone here knows that.}

I suggest you benefit yourself with your RCIA membership and learn to clean roofs the RCIA way, instead of nitpicking those 50 point standards to justify cleaning roofs as you already do?

Once you do it our way, you will throw your pump up sprayer and spider away and start making $ without knocking a granule off a roof. Notice, my video was like 3 minutes and I cleaned 1 section of that roof.

Instead of fighting back with me, open your mind up and be ready to change. That's what I did!

I pressure washed roofs for years, used a pitch with and almost took my flat surface cleaner up there one day [like the "roof shampoo" franchise company does roof cleaning.Watch this video: In the beginning, you see the guy with a pressure washing gun, waiting for his soap/chlorine to get to the gun. After lots of testing, of dozens of different downstream chemical injectors [including the Super Suds Sucker] they average 9-10% SH to 90% water. So, that's what these guys apply to kill all that algae and fungus on that roof! Then, at abour 4-5 minutes into the video, out comes the big ole' cement surface cleaner! BYE BYE granules! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewbG622wYiY

I only posted a link, because this discussion is on the Premium side and not public.

In early 1991 I was trying to invent [I thought] our system and failed a few times with pumps that wouldn't push the mix up onto the roofs. After a few months efforts, I gave up.

I was sure happy in late 1991 when I learned this method from another pressure washing company that drove 40 miles to clean in my town! I asked about their method and they were nice enough to show me everything and explain it! Back then, it was a little 1 gpm ShurFlo pump and 1/4" ID hose and a pressure washing gun, with short lance.

At RCIA I have learned many upgrades and tips, making my fees here, well worthwhile!

If you decide to give up the fight [so to speak] and just go ahead and invest the small amount of money needed for our systems, you will think "I'm sure glad that jerk Chuck Bergman gave me such a hard time! Now I do 3 roofs in the time I did one before, with zero granule loss"

You paid to be one of us, may as well be one! I absolutely guarantee you will be glad you did!

I have put considerable time [2 finger typist cry ] and effort into this post for you. I hope you use it to your benefit.

Here is a longer roof cleaning video of mine, with my son on the roof. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPCtVUu3Si0&feature=plcp

Mean, ugly, Chuck biggrin


You are wrong with both of your guesses. The info is on one of my
websites-Brink kanga roof

I am doing what #12,13,16 on your RCIA 50pt standards says I can do.


Sorry you have met a lot of bad roofers. Most of the good and
honest people in the roofing industry aren't found in bars.

Your whole sales pitch is off of two ARMA bulletins that do not say what
you are claiming they say. Read them word for word like I said earlier.

I understand you are using them both as a sales tool. No problem, just don't start believing
and telling me it says something that it doesn't.

If you click on make an appointment on my website, you will see that they can make an appointment
under (roof Cleaning / Roof Repairs / Roof Replacements / or warranty appointment)

If someone chooses a roof cleaning appointment, then I understand that is what they want or think
they want.

but I recommend whatever I believe is in the best.
interest of the homeowner and then let them decide. Everybody should show
video's and pictures to there customers. Otherwise they are making decisions
on something they can't even see. I say don't make the decision for them.

If I went to a home that had green shingles only a year old and they wanted me to
remove the and put on white ones. That is there decision. Do I say, no it's only
one year old and argue. Call them nuts. Make them feel stupid. No, it's there money.
If that's what they want to do then that's fine with me.

Educate the homeowner - do a good inspection - show them all of the inspection results -
Give them some options and let them choose.

Example - Leak in a valley - Roof is 12 yrs. old. Roofer 1 says I will fix it for 200 bucks and
uses some tar and mesh.

Roofer 2 says I'll do it for 1,200. I'll remove the shingles and install a new valley with ice guard/etc.


Who's ripping them off- Roofer 1 comes back once a year for the next 8 yrs. (20yr. roof) (1,600) without inflation.'
or even worse they end up noticing 5 yrs. down the road that it is leaking again. So now...factor in the drywall damages
and insulation that is ruined etc.

Roofer 2 gave them a warranty that would last them 8 yrs. for (1,200)
What's sad is 90% of the roofing company owners are choosing #1 and not offering #2.
That's a scam if you ask me. Offer them both. Don't decide for the homeowner or you are a pushy salesman.

I like your video, but doesn't that solution/spray become slippery when you are walking directly on it? Especially
when it is shown from the side view in the end. Looks steep from the side view.


Click here and you will see where they sell what I refer to as a spider cleaning machine

 

I just call it spider because I think it sounds better.  I also don't shoot the chemical out of the machine.  Instead

I use back pack sprayers.  The specs for the machine comply with the RCIA 50 pt.  number 12,13, and 16



Attachments
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Serving Englewood Rotonda North Port Cape Haze Venice Port Charlotte Punta Gorda Boca Grande Charlotte and Southern Sarasota Counties in Florida.

941-698-1959
www.bergmanroofcleaning.com

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RNlN3R7CqI



Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America Certified Roof Cleaning Specialist

Status: Offline
Posts: 2070
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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-- Edited by Roof Cleaning New Jersey on Friday 21st of September 2012 09:31:06 AM

__________________

Ed Thompson
Woodbridge N.J.

(732) 726-9261
Digital Brochure

 

 

 



Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 103
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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4 step process, not 3.

I'll explain it exactly. This will give you some more
ammo.

1st is the exact ''apple sauce mixture'' but using bleach
that can be bought at home depot.

2nd - Sodium Hydroxide - also known as M-1 from home depot
or bought in packets from cleaner today website.

3rd - Rinse - with the spider or a hose. I used a hose on the roof that
has black shingles. That was before we had the spider. I do not use high
pressure. I do go by your 50pts standards I was talking about. YES, please
remove them if you aren't going to acknowledge they even exist. Misleading.

After the first two sprays there is no need to blast them. It rinses right off.
The spider is basically for show. We could use just a hose at that point.

4th - A product called roof armor from cleaner today website, or a wet
and forget product. I know the spray and forget and the wet and forget
aren't good products but I am just using it at the end when it is clean.

For the next five years I go back to the home and spray the first solution
or the fourth one. That is the 5yr. no stain warranty.

Why did I go to all this trouble?
Because I own a roofing company with a lot of roofers working for me.
Homeowners were in need of roof cleaning. I read about Chris Tuckers
''Apple Sauce"Mixture.
I really didn't trust my roofers to spray 12% when they haven't even done it
before. I could see a nightmare coming. I couldn't trust them spraying that yet.

 

As I researched....I found a huge group of people talking AGAINST every type.

People didn't like sodium hydroxide,  some didn't like the "apple sauce", some

didn't like any pressure, most didn't like wet and forget or spray and forget., or the

roof armor which I think is some type of moldstat?

 

I made the choice to use all of methods/chemicals.  Just not as strong.

I have made a lot of homeowners happy and there roof is under our warranty.

 

I am looking for a more productive way.  That is why I am here.  I started to

defend myself only after you were acting like I'm a dummy. 

 

There is a few more clips of ammo for you Mr. Bergman.  So load em up and let err rip!



-- Edited by Onarooftop on Friday 21st of September 2012 09:49:19 AM



-- Edited by Onarooftop on Friday 21st of September 2012 09:52:31 AM

__________________

Authorized "Roof Max" Dealer

Email Kyle@Brinkroofing.com

for info.

5440 Buffalo Rd.

Erie, PA 16510

814-898-HOME




Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America Certified Roof Cleaning Specialist

Status: Offline
Posts: 2070
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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That 4 step process sounds like a real Rube Goldberg

__________________

Ed Thompson
Woodbridge N.J.

(732) 726-9261
Digital Brochure

 

 

 



Guest

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Posts: 1342
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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Man Ed, you're right,.."Gee, lets see how many steps we can have in a normally simple process". The guy said he came here to learn better ways,..well he should be about ready to throw his ideas about roof cleaning out the window.
Seriously, from  where he purchases his products to the method used to do the WORK,..he's way off base coming here and stirring things up, because he isn't anything like a qualified roof cleaner. Why would anyone get up on the roof that way and risk damage to self or property to put on a show. Actually they wouldn't,..from his explanation of his work method,..I am pretty sure that contraption IS being used to do the work,..because he's not getting a proper mix applied with his back pack sprayer,.. so he then relies on the spray thingy to do the work. Then I guess he rinses with a hose to send loose granules into the gutters.

Hydroxide is ONLY ok to add to the mix on certain types of roofing material,..and asphalt shingles aren't on the list.

(AC, is this you coming here in disguise to get things livened up around here)

Jeff









-- Edited by Raystown Roof Cleaning Central PA 1-800-236-0322 on Friday 21st of September 2012 12:58:35 PM

__________________

Raystown Roof Cleaning
Central, Pa

(814) 644-1396 or 1-800-236-0322

Roof Cleaning Central Pennsylvania

Huntingdon, State College, Lewistown, Altoona









Guest

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Posts: 747
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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I have a 3 questions about your 4 step process on 5/12 pitch, 2,000 sf asphalt shingle roof:

* How many guys would you put on that job (ground guy - applicator)?

* How many hours does it take to complete?

* What would you quote for a roof like discribed above?

 

Just wondering because it sounds very time consuming. I know up north you can get a lot more per SF then down here in Florida but it sounds like it would take a full day for that 2,000 sf roof.



-- Edited by Roof Cleaning Tallahassee on Friday 21st of September 2012 01:14:51 PM

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Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 103
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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Read the whole thread from beginning to end since I got in here.
I wasn't in here stirring up anything or or even defending the way I do it. All I
did was introduce myself and it turned into a race to look at my website and try
to stirr things up yourself.

I stuck up for myself when Mr. Bergman started acting like I don't read bulletins
that are written in my roofing industry. I have read the bulletins and pulled him
out on the carpet for using the bulletins by stretching the truth in what it says.
Read what his ad says on his website and Read the bulletins word for word.

If you paid 250 bucks to join a roofing forum, which you wouldn't because they are free and you can
use the logo for free.
But, if you did....and I started saying that you don't know what you are talking about
and do you even read the bulletins in your own industry. You'd defend yourself.
It's not stirring it up Jeff.

I came in here nice. You are determined to say I am blasting off granules.
I go by your 50 pt. standards. You can't even identify the machine but you know
exactly how many granules it is blowing off. Come look in the gutters before and
after I rinse. I said i use it to rinse. Can you please read the whole thing.

I am the nicest guy in the world to any of my workers, children, and strangers. But, I
don't hesitate to slap a jerk that is trying to start something. So, go ahead. Read this post
really carefully.......then pick your belly up off of the keyboard and attack again. lol. Very
predictable.

Yes it is very time consuming. That is why I paid 250 dollars to be part of this forum.
So I could learn ways to speed up the process, and I said that in the last post.

"I am looking for a more productive way. That is why I am here."
That is what I said at the bottom of my last post? You skim over those parts.

Much respect for the ones who private messaged me with tips and help. You have already
helped me more then the few mouths on here ever will.

It's like any forum. You have the group of kids that are in the middle of the playground
playing nice and productively building a sand castle., and then you have the handful
of kids flexing there muscles trying to hold the gate closed and throwing sand at someone trying to get in.

 

Tallahassee, I just sold one almost exactly that size.  I was 1,590 but they were considering a guy that

uses the surface cleaner machine for 700 dollars.  So, I came down to 1,390 to win the job.  I'm about 75 a sq.

and up.  I am making money, but I would like to speed up the process like I was saying earlier.  That is why I

signed up.

 



__________________

Authorized "Roof Max" Dealer

Email Kyle@Brinkroofing.com

for info.

5440 Buffalo Rd.

Erie, PA 16510

814-898-HOME




Guest

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Date: Sep 21, 2012
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$1,390??? Nice. I could only dream of numbers like that.

There are a few place that sell "ready to go" skids for pick-up beds and also less expensive "kits" that just require a tank. There are a ton of great threads in here that will more then get you ready to try out on your own roof or friends and family before you get on a customers roof. I read just about every thread on this forum (till my eyes were bleeding) before my first post but the info I gained from them has been invaluable! Also I have seen it posted many times here that guys were willing to give free hands on training for free labor. Look for cleaners a few hours away from your location and give them a call. I'm sure they would be willing to give a live demo on a job at the very least.



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Guest

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Date: Sep 21, 2012
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First off, people who come here to learn don't make 3-4 paragraph posts. You give the sense that you're defending your method,..which will tend to stir things up around here. I couldn't care less about the 50 point thing. If you were truly here to learn,.. you'd have read ALOT after an introduction post,..and most likely we would have never heard of your screwy roof cleaning ideas. And I have read all of the posts,..and you're just asking for anything you get. I don't need to read bulletins to clean a roof properly. I have never read any bulletin on roof cleaning,..I could probably write one though. If you're so big on bulletins then you'd have read beforehand and never even tried to clean a roof using your multiple step method.

Jeff

__________________

Raystown Roof Cleaning
Central, Pa

(814) 644-1396 or 1-800-236-0322

Roof Cleaning Central Pennsylvania

Huntingdon, State College, Lewistown, Altoona









Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America Certified Roof Cleaning Specialist

Status: Offline
Posts: 2070
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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$2000 roof cleanings may be currently justifiable, but they will be short lived, soon to be "remember when" stories. Another will come along with the same epiphany that there are roofs to clean, and they may choose the easier, safer, more highly recommended method and price you right out of business.

Jeff is right. Alot of explaining going on with record breaking lengthy paragraphs. I say keep cleaning roofs the way youre doing it. It never once sounded like you were willing to adopt any other method other than the way its currently being done. Im gonna go now and do that Black Jack dealer thing, clap my hands and turn em over once which means Im going on break from this issue.


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Ed Thompson
Woodbridge N.J.

(732) 726-9261
Digital Brochure

 

 

 



Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 399
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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nevermind, my helpful statement would have prob been seen as provacative so I'll delete it... done

Jeff already noted it I see



-- Edited by Maverick Contracting on Friday 21st of September 2012 05:21:32 PM

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Long Island, N.Y.



Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute Of America Certified Roof Cleaning Specialist

Status: Offline
Posts: 3547
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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Bill's pics are still on your website.

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240-355-1110

From up on the Roof cleaning, Gutter cleaning, to down on the Concrete cleaning...

All pressure washing services in between!

Serving  PG, Charles, St Marys and Calvert county Maryland

Cleaning service 




Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America Certifiied Roof Cleaning Specialist

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Posts: 1439
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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Here is a Bulletin straight from Certainteed in PA your neck of the woods. Its fairly cut and dry... No concrete surface cleaners, pitch witches or spyders mentioned in their required cleaning method? 

 

 

Scan0009_zpsef9cdca3.jpgScan0010_zps1df94cef.jpg



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Ugly Shingles LLC Roof Cleaning Metro Detroit 

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Roof Cleaning MI



Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 103
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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Here is my RCIA Experience so far....

-Wanted to learn a more productive and profitable way
-Invested 250 dollars
-Read through a lot of posts
-Introduced myself
-Tried to answer all of the questions thrown at me to sucker me in and then blast me.
-In between answering questions I defended myself
-Offered a tip on a roofing product/trick that would help everyone - 2 nice people responded.

Nice and Helpful people in life - are that way the moment you meet - no hurdles to jump - that's just who they are

I'll be here for life and help the newcomers with what I learn - I'll help change how the newcomers are greeted.
They'll be sent a greeting email, a phone call,a video, t-shirt, safety manual and encouraged to post. I will not make
fun of anyone for what they don't know.  Sorry to whoever I offended when I was mad and defending myself.

My plan is to do what I did with roofing. Seek out the nicest / professional / profitable / honest / successful businessman in here
and learn from him. The rest of you and your smart comments mean nothing to me. I failed and let them fire me up. Your a waste of my time and money.
Along the way maybe I'll meet some other nice people. Paul your the nicest guy yet, Thanks.

My mentor in roofing owns and runs a 20+million dollars worth of revenue a yr. Most humble and helpful person that
I met in my life. From the moment I said Hi.

It's great to be a member!

Helpful Tip that I truly hope helps: You don't have to find a supplier in your area to find the rubber pipe collars. They have never sold them
in my area. I never even knew they made them separate. I found out one day that they aren't fused together.
It was the only thing I had in a winter storm and I said, Damn I wish this thing would just pull apart.............It did!
Take any pipe boot flange from home depot or any other home improvement store. Pull like crazy! The rubber
isn't fused or glued on there! It will come apart. Then recycle the aluminum flange. I wish I knew that a long
time ago. I could have made a lot of money and helped a lot of people with that knowledge.




-- Edited by Onarooftop on Friday 21st of September 2012 08:43:42 PM

__________________

Authorized "Roof Max" Dealer

Email Kyle@Brinkroofing.com

for info.

5440 Buffalo Rd.

Erie, PA 16510

814-898-HOME




Guest

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Posts: 1617
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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Ive not read the whole thread, as I'm on vacation! However I did want to chime in with my two cents. I am being totally nonjudgmental here but I think if you will try cleaning with Just the applesauce solution and RCIA method you'll be sold on that process and the results! I think you'll find it cut down on a great deal of time and labor on the process you're using right now.

I like to hear about the different methods and processes other folks use. But if you will skip the sodium hydroxide step and kick your SH percentage you'll be able to skip that whole process!

__________________
Ray Burke
Spray Wash Exterior Cleaning
850.528.3226
visit our website
Soft Washing and Pressure Washing
Licensed & Insured
Serving Tallahassee, FL, The Big Bend
and SW Georgia
http://www.spray-wash.com
 


Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 103
Date: Sep 21, 2012
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Thanks sweetwaterfish,

Thanks for the bulletin. That was pretty cool to see.

Personally I hate certainteed though. If you scroll back a page or 2 you will
see what settlement they pay out for a roof that failed. (New Horizon)
I don't know if it happened in everyone's area, but whole developments of housing
had certainteed shingles that fell apart at 15 yrs. They were 30yr. shingles. They
only gave them a few hundred per house.
For every roof cleaning business there is , they lose money.

Do not use high pressure? How high is high pressure. What is says in your 50 pt standards?

You can use a pitch witch, a glass of water, a tea pot, gatorade bottle, squirt gun. It doesn't
matter as long as you aren't using to high of pressure. Period.

__________________

Authorized "Roof Max" Dealer

Email Kyle@Brinkroofing.com

for info.

5440 Buffalo Rd.

Erie, PA 16510

814-898-HOME




Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 103
Date: Sep 21, 2012
Permalink  
 


I actually don't like using the spider.
I do it for rinsing and just for show.
That is why I am here.

Where can I buy the stronger bleach / 12%
Can I get it shipped to my shop/warehouse?

Thanks

__________________

Authorized "Roof Max" Dealer

Email Kyle@Brinkroofing.com

for info.

5440 Buffalo Rd.

Erie, PA 16510

814-898-HOME




Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute Of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 1064
Date: Sep 21, 2012
Permalink  
 

Check with your local pool supply company and see if they'll allow you to purchase sh in bulk. This way you can keep it local for now. If things take off there are other chemical suppliers nationwide you can contact. Prices for us in the northeast is considerably higher than our fellow roof cleaners down south. Sh can also be used for other types of exterior cleaning(soft wash) such as vinyl siding, dryvit, stucco, T-111, etc.. With a low pressure system you can have a crew working daily just doing exterior cleaning with a minimal investment.

Hank



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Pocono Non Pressure Roof & Exterior Cleaning, LLC

Stroudsburg, PA 18360

570-994-6918

Serving the Pocono and Lehigh Valley(Carbon, Lehigh, Northampton, Monroe, Pike and Wayne Counties), PA community as well as both Warren and Sussex Counties of New Jersey



Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America

Status: Offline
Posts: 103
Date: Sep 21, 2012
Permalink  
 

So does anyone use tablets / or pool shock / etc?

__________________

Authorized "Roof Max" Dealer

Email Kyle@Brinkroofing.com

for info.

5440 Buffalo Rd.

Erie, PA 16510

814-898-HOME




Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute Of America Certified Roof Cleaning Specialist

Status: Offline
Posts: 3547
Date: Sep 21, 2012
Permalink  
 

This guy a joke. Treat him like one, please.

__________________

240-355-1110

From up on the Roof cleaning, Gutter cleaning, to down on the Concrete cleaning...

All pressure washing services in between!

Serving  PG, Charles, St Marys and Calvert county Maryland

Cleaning service 


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