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Roof Cleaning Little Rock Arkansas · Guest

RE: Thick Roof Cleaning Mixtures

Eric · Guest

Thanks I will do, It will be in the mid 60's this week,so I will give it a try!

Thanks again!

RCIA Founder

Eric wrote:

So from what I am reading the best thing to do is add some TSP?

I have 4 roofs this week and just got a gallon of Ammonyx LO.

I am looking for the best way to use Ammonyx LO, and still do a good job!

I am going to mix up about 40 gallons or so and am looking for the BEST mix to get with using Ammonyx LOOk

Ok, try this mix, for 40 gallons, use 1/4 to 1/2 cup TSP per gallon and from 1/8 to 1/4 Gallon Ammonyx LO.
The combo of Ammonyx LO and TSP is synergistic, meaning you don't need as much when adding the 2 ingredients together.
I would stay closer to 1/8 of a gallon of Ammonyx LO and 1/4 cup TSP, unless the roof is pretty steep, or really filthy.
If really filthy, increase TSP to 1/2 cup, no more.
If steep, increase Ammonyx LO to 1/4 gallon for thicker mix.
Try to add the TSP to warm or hot water all by itself first, stir well, let sit, stir again, add Ammonyx LO, then add SH, stir again, and go get paid!

Eric · Guest

So from what I am reading the best thing to do is add some TSP?

I have 4 roofs this week and just got a gallon of Ammonyx LO.

I am looking for the best way to use Ammonyx LO, and still do a good job!

I am going to mix up about 40 gallons or so and am looking for the BEST mix to get with using Ammonyx LO ?

andy hinson · Feb 28, 2010

gliderflier wrote:

Andy, what didn't you like about the ammonyx in the mix? I was planning on using it in roof mix. Too thick? Too what?

No problem with the ammonyx. I tried it without TSP.
That. I wont do again.

RCIA Founder

ChrisDuffy wrote:

Thanks Chris with helping out with the signature. What else besides tsp can i mix with ammonyx lo for good cleaning because i dont want to use a soap like usual becase that will add more foam which i will be getting from ammonyx lo.

THAT mix will be enough for all but the MOST filthy of roofs, but ya can carry some rubbing alcohol to dump in, just be aware it will burn your mix up real quick (like in 3 days)
When used with Ammonyx LO, 1/4 to 1/2 cup of TSP per gallon is plenty.
Got to be careful with overly strong TSP mixtures, it can effct paint, clog screens, etc, etc!

ChrisDuffy · Guest

Thanks Chris with helping out with the signature. What else besides tsp can i mix with ammonyx lo for good cleaning because i dont want to use a soap like usual becase that will add more foam which i will be getting from ammonyx lo.

RCIA Founder

Roof Cleaning Arkansas wrote:

AHINSON wrote:
You have a nice website Chris.
I used the ammonyx lo in a house wash mix and a roof cleaning mix.
It seemed to work well if properly mixed.
I used it as a test on the roof. I allowed the ammonyx to replace TSP and Dawn.
I will not do that again.

Thanks Andy.

What did you not like about ammonyx lo?

I have a sample of Barlox waiting on me at my supplier. I really liked the idea of having a really sticky mix and not killing the sh in the process.

It could be great for some of the steep roofs around here that are surrounded by expensive vegetation.

I havent used it though. So I wouldnt Know yet.

LOL, it is the TSP you are missing.
Ammonyx is a far better surfactant then Dawn, but does not have the sheer cleaning power of good old TSP.

Just some are too lazy to properly mix and use TSP, or have other concerns about it.
But make NO mistake, used and mixed properly, TSP is unequalled as a roof cleaning additive.
Put the TSP back in your mix, and use the Ammonyx in place of Dawn, best of both worlds, just do not use TOO much Ammonyx LO, or you will have to wait for a good rain biggrin

Roof Cleaning Little Rock Arkansas · Guest

AHINSON wrote:
You have a nice website Chris.
I used the ammonyx lo in a house wash mix and a roof cleaning mix.
It seemed to work well if properly mixed.
I used it as a test on the roof. I allowed the ammonyx to replace TSP and Dawn.
I will not do that again.

Thanks Andy.

What did you not like about ammonyx lo?

I have a sample of Barlox waiting on me at my supplier. I really liked the idea of having a really sticky mix and not killing the sh in the process.

It could be great for some of the steep roofs around here that are surrounded by expensive vegetation.

I havent used it though. So I wouldnt Know yet.

RCIA Founder

ChrisDuffy wrote:

im getting my ammonyx lo this week monday i think i will tell you guys how it is. thanks chris for all that information any thing that helps you with more knowledge can get you more business.

I "fixed" your signature too Chris.
I was going to use Green, since I think Duffy is an Irish name ?
However, it did not match the color of your adorable little guys bike!
The blue we have availiable on the forum colors was not a match either.
You have a black truck on your web page picture, so I chose black.

Guest

Andy, what didn't you like about the ammonyx in the mix? I was planning on using it in roof mix. Too thick? Too what?

andy hinson · Feb 28, 2010

Roof Cleaning Arkansas wrote:

Alright Chris Im going to go ahead and say it. The only formulas I like have dollar signs in them. Im not a scientist or a tinkerer. I like to find something that works then work it.
In laymens terms... I may have skipped a few words in your post!
But i am looking into ammonyx lo and barlox for my roof cleaning and housewashing.

You have a nice website Chris.
I used the ammonyx lo in a house wash mix and a roof cleaning mix.
It seemed to work well if properly mixed.
I used it as a test on the roof. I allowed the ammonyx to replace TSP and Dawn.
I will not do that again.

Roof Cleaning Wallace N.C 910-463-8400 · Guest

I here you Chris! i just scheduled to jobs saturday and i am going to try throwing the ammonyx low in the sauce. i will keep you posted.

ChrisDuffy · Guest

im getting my ammonyx lo this week monday i think i will tell you guys how it is. thanks chris for all that information any thing that helps you with more knowledge can get you more business.

Roof Cleaning Little Rock Arkansas · Guest

Thanks for fixing my sig Chris. I have heard a little will go a loooooooong way as far as the barlox and amonyx lo go. Something sticky will be nice.

RCIA Founder

Roof Cleaning Arkansas wrote:

Alright Chris Im going to go ahead and say it. The only formulas I like have dollar signs in them. Im not a scientist or a tinkerer. I like to find something that works then work it.
In laymens terms... I may have skipped a few words in your post!
But i am looking into ammonyx lo and barlox for my roof cleaning and housewashing.

It will be good for both, just be conservative adding it, it is MUCH stronger then Dawn.
I tried to fix your signature, the bottom link was inactive, I made it link to your roof cleaning page, tried to match your logo color and font, did the best I could w/o knowing what kind of font that is in your Logo ?
Nice trailer you have there, like that yellow compressor biggrin

Roof Cleaning Little Rock Arkansas · Guest

Alright Chris Im going to go ahead and say it. The only formulas I like have dollar signs in them. Im not a scientist or a tinkerer. I like to find something that works then work it.
In laymens terms... I may have skipped a few words in your post!
But i am looking into ammonyx lo and barlox for my roof cleaning and housewashing.

RCIA Founder

Thickened Bleach

These are formulations for thickened bleach.

Sodium hypochlorite solutions are widely used in both the domestic and institutional area where they provide comprehensive germicidal properties as well as the known bleaching effect.

Simple sodium hypochlorite bleach solutions are, however very thin. This makes it difficult to achieve direct and prolonged contact of the liquid bleach with non-horizontal surfaces requiring cleaning and sanitisation, eg the sides of a lavatory pan or drain/waste pipes. The thickening of a liquid bleach improves it's clinging power on vertical or inclined surfaces, allowing it to remain in contact with such surfaces much longer and, thereby, carry out its sanitising and cleaning function more efficiently.

The thickening of liquid bleaches is generally achieved by the use of surface active agents. The thickened bleaches will, therefore, also have a certain cleaning power attributable to those components.

The thickening of liquid bleaches also renders them easier to apply, less prone to dripping or splashing, and conveys to the consumers and impression of strength, all useful marketing points.

"Industrial" sodium hypochlorite used for the preparation of domestic bleach products generally contains approximately 16% of sodium hypochlorite itself, with an equivalent or slightly higher level of sodium chloride also being present. Because not all of sodium hypochlorite present is available for reaction purposes, it is very common to see the term "Available Chlorine" used to express the concentration of sodium hypochlorite liquors. Industrial sodium hypochlorite contains approximately 14-15% of available chlorine.

Domestic bleach products are prepared by dilution of the industrial sodium hypochloride, to available chloride levels ranging from 2% to 10%. A small amount of sodium hydroxide is generally added to aid its stability. This bleach can then be optionally thickened and/fragranced as required.

The performance of a combination of two surfactants, alkyl dimethyl amine oxide and ether sulphate will be dependant upon the formulation characteristics required.

The following guideline formulations for unfragranced thickened liquid bleaches and are suggested as a suitable starting points for any development work.

Unfragranced thickened liquid bleach

2% available Chlorine:

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
APPROXIMATE VISCOSITY (cps)		100
Sodium Hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	13.8%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	2.0%
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	2.5%
Water	Aqua	balance

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
APPROXIMATE VISCOSITY (cps)		200
Sodium Hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	13.8%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	2.5%
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	3.5%
Water	Aqua	balance

5% Available Chlorine

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx Viscosity(cps)		100
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	34.5%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	3.2%
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	-
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	2.0%
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
Water	Aqua	balance

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx Viscosity(cps)		200
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	34.5%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	3.5%
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	-
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	2.3%
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
Water	Aqua	balance

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx Viscosity(cps)		300
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	34.5%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	-
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	5.0%
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	1.5%
Water	Aqua	balance

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx Viscosity(cps)		400
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	34.5%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	-
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	6.0%
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	2.2%
Water	Aqua	balance

9% Available Chloride

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx. Viscosity(cps)		100
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	62.0%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	4.5%
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	-
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	2.0%
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
Water	Aqua	balance

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx. Viscosity(cps)		200
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	62.0%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	5.5%
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	-
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	2.5%
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
Water	Aqua	balance

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx. Viscosity(cps)		300
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	62.0%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	-
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	4.5%
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	0.8%
Water	Aqua	balance

Product	Chemical Description	% W/W
Approx. Viscosity(cps)		400
Sodium hypochlorite	Sodium Hypochlorite	62.0%
Sodium hydroxide	Sodium hydroxide	1.0%
AMMONYX LO	C12-C14 Alkyldimethylamine Oxide	-
AMMONYX M	Myristamine Oxide	5.5%
STEOL CS 230-KE	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	-
STEOL BES27-D5	Sodium Laureth Sulphate	1.2%
Water	Aqua	balance

Note:
The sodium hypochlorite is taken as containing 14.5% available chlorine.

The viscosity of the formulation is measured at 20^oC using brookfield RVT viscometer.

The following order mixing is recommended:

Water
Sodium hydroxide
AMMONYX LO or AMMONYX M
STEOL CS 230-KE OR STEOL BES27-D5
Sodium hypochlorite

A simple mixing system , providing homogeneous blending at each stage, should prove satisfactory.
Foam generation should preferably be kept to a minimum.

The high temperature cloud point of the formulated bleach can be taken as an indication of it's physical stability. It is recommended that a high temperature cloud point of 40^oC minimum be achieved, although a higher figure may be preferable on bleaches intended to be marketed in countries where the ambient temperatures are relatively high.

Formulators should ensure that the extended storage stability of each bleach is suitable for their market requirements. Fragranced thickened liquid bleaches can be produced by the incorporation of suitable chlorine stable perfumes.

The addition of the perfume can, however, significantly alter the stability characteristics of thickened bleach and normally adjustments have to be made to the amine oxide to ether sulphate ratio to accommodate perfume inclusion. Fragranced formulations generally contain more amine oxide than their unfragranced counterparts, the amine oxide aiding the solubilisation of the perfumes.

Each perfume, depending on its individual make-up, will affect any bleach formulation to a different degree. It is therefore difficult to offer general advice on thickened bleach formulations including perfumes.

Industrial sodium hypochlorite will vary in composition depending on the source of manufacture and thereby the characteristics of thickened bleaches produced from them will differ to some degree.

Each source of industrial sodium hypochlorite should therefore be examined for suitability in any particular thickened bleach formulation.

Sodium hypochlorite solutions are inherently unstable and slowly decompose with time. Certain factors, in particular the presence of metal such as iron, copper, nickel an cobalt, can accelerate and decomposition and it is important that the introduction of such metals into thickened bleaches, via either the raw materials or the manufacturing process, be kept to a minimum.

All quantities unless otherwise shown are stated as weight for weight.

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Thickened Bleach

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