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Dec 14, 2009

Hmmmm, just thinking? Is there a Chlorine Neutralizer, that can be soaked into the ground by plants ahead of time?

Roof Cleaning Toledo Ohio (419) 265-3306 · Guest

Chuck, That would be nice if there was such a product to nuetralize the shc. Do you work alone? I see you tarp all the plants. Toledo Roof Cleaning always uses a ground man to keep everything wet.

PrestigePressure · Guest

If there is something like that on the market let me know. I'll a few drums of it. That would be nice Chuck, just think how much time and water that would save.

NJ Roof Cleaner · Guest

hi!!
Mr Bergman.
I'm pretty sure that will be not impossible but.... it will be expensive to find! (with SH)
there are thousands of different plats in the USA and in the World!! plants react to different environments like:soil,water, temperature,region (north,south,east,west) even wind conditions!!

This is a Good question to MR. AC. From "Mallard Systems" As I read before (in other forums) he uses a combination of "herbicides and pesticides" giving 5 year warranty on his jobs, while every body else is using SH!! now pesticides an herbicide are a whole different thing in licensing.... they hard to get!!!
Just my opinion guys!!
Ivan

Guest

I know in swimming pools and spas they use a chemical called sodium thiosulfate to neutralize chlorine. I'm sure it would perform the same function with our cleaning chemicals, but what effect will it have on the plants roots? It is a sodium based chemical and plants are very sensitive to sodium shock also. Sodium hypochlorite and sodium thiosulfate could be far too much sodium for the plants roots to handle.

I'm no chemist either, but I would definitely be concerned with the adverse effects of any neutralizing chemical. We spend a lot of time watering down the shrubbery. It sure would be nice to cut that time down. I just don't see a whole lot of promise with a neutralizing chemical.

Brian

garyw · Dec 15, 2009

If the "new" chemical we're researching, "Twin Oxide", works out the problem with watering plants may be greatly diminished.
We are waiting on the samples and documentation to enable us to do a cleaning demo here in Louisville.
Keep watching for updates as they occur.

RoofBright of Florida · Guest

There is a product out there which I believe is called PacRite Chlor-out. It is used to neutralize sodium hypochlorite in water. Not sure if this would work or even if it would be cost effective. I suppose further research is in order.

RoofBright of Florida · Guest

This is hearsay, but I have heard Vinegar!

idontknow · Guest

Remember Chlorine is used in your swimming pool, and as such there are hundreds of chems to play with in regards to chlorine.

Now, the main thing is PH (acid , neutral or alkaline) if some thing is PH neutral then all is OK (including your plants) Chlorine as we get it is Alkaline ph some thing like 11, there are products like "PH UP' soda ash to raise the PH level and "PH DOWN" like sodium bisulphate (dry acid) & Hydrochloric Acid / to lower the PH (or nutralize the chlorine) how about mixing some weak Hypochloric acid in a watering can and sprinkling the "GROUND" around the garden? to nutralize the High Ph of the chlorine. Remember all things living only have a very small PH range that they can survive in (including us) so be carefull

Now since you raised this question, in my researching it seems that the hypochlorous acid part of the chlorine dose most of the work for killing mold, fungus viruses etc. with a low PH around 7 (neutral ph) which by the way at this ph level dose not corrode any thing "non corrosive" and is harmless to most things including plants, so one would assume that this would be the optimal ph for killing mold.

But

as a cleaner High ph is usefull (alkaline, sodium hydroxide, costic etc.)

has anyone ever played around with the PH of the mix? it seems easy enough to change the ph to suite or requirements, ph up, ph down, it is simple to do , thousands of people every day do it to their pools and it would be easy for us to do if we knew what the optimum ph for roof cleaning was. a small change in PH makes a huge differance and infact changes what we are using.

Links out of interest:
http://www.rhtubs.com/pH.htm
http://science.howstuffworks.com/question652.htm
there are more intereting ones but I can not be bothered finding them again at the moment

guest

Idontknow

so do you think some oxalic acid would work?

idontknow · Guest

I suppose acid is acid (vinigar is an acid) but I would stick to the common pool products as these are proven to be safe(ish) when mixed with chlorine, also remember that because we use a VERY HIGH concentration of chlorine as opposed to swimming pools lower levels of chlorine the chemical reactions especially when mixed in tanks will be more reactive (no smoking) as far as gardens are concerned you only have to nutralize the chlorine on the ground so VERY WEAK dilutions should do the job, you can buy cheap digital ph meters about $50 they will tell you exactly what the ph is (in you tank or in the ground) ph of around 7 is nutral for the ground, although Roses like acidic soil but thats another story

idontknow · Guest

You could also try "activated carbon" if you can get it in a fine powder form may be. Activated carbon obsorbs chlorine, it is used in water filters for drinking water, fish tanks etc, it is cheap buying in bulk bags 50 lbs, may be sprinkle some around the garden beds and it will soak up the chlorine (may be) also removes the chlorine odor

idontknow · Guest

Ok I don't want to bug anyone or upset the board, so before I go on, Please let me know if my posts are annoying you or if you prefer that I stop talking/posting and I will back off as requested.

But I have this PH thing in my mind and it won't go away and this is the only place I have to talk about it. So I will speak my peice then shut up.

From what I have researched the PH of Sodium Hypochlorite is very important in regards to how it dose the job, At Ph 7.0 to 7.4 chlorine is at an optimum level to kill moss, mold fungus, viruses etc. At Ph 7.0ish it also has less smell, is non corrosive (pumps fittings, gutters and you), is plant friendly and has a high value of "free chlorine" which is the stuff that dose the job.
Hypochlorite as we get it has a PH of around 11 which is very alkaline and at this PH level is the "least effective" in killing moss, mold etc (look at the link chart below) It is, in my opinion very important to adjust the PH level of the mix to a neutral 7.0 to 7.4Ph

Why? I think it will work better, you could use "less" of it plus all of the benifits as mentioned above. No I have not tried it yet, I am just thinking out loud

Please look at this site, it has a pritty chart on it that shows what I am talking about http://www.caromal.co.uk/Resource%20Page%205.HTM remember that the hypochlorite seems to do very little for us where as the "free chlorine" hypochlorous acid is the main killing machine. look at what we have at a Ph of 11.0 (the way it comes) At a pH value of 11 pH, the Free Chlorine exists as 0.03% Hypochlorous Acid (HOCL)and 99.97% Hypochlorite Ion (OCL) it is 99.97% Hypochlorite Ion (this is the least effective and useless part of chlorine) and the good stuff is only 0.03% hmmmm

No one here seems to mention the Ph thing, even the search box only has a few items

Am I wrong about all this?

I also like this page http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=howTo&p=LawnGarden/MaintPool.html there is a table about half way down mentioning common problems, alge, smell etc. it all seems to come back to the PH levels

Cheers

-- Edited by idontknow on Thursday 17th of December 2009 12:11:43 AM

KP Diamond · Guest

idontknow wrote:

Ok I don't want to bug anyone or upset the board, so before I go on, Please let me know if my posts are annoying you or if you prefer that I stop talking/posting and I will back off as requested.

But I have this PH thing in my mind and it won't go away and this is the only place I have to talk about it. So I will speak my peice then shut up.

From what I have researched the PH of Sodium Hypochlorite is very important in regards to how it dose the job, At Ph 7.0 to 7.4 chlorine is at an optimum level to kill moss, mold fungus, viruses etc. At Ph 7.0ish it also has less smell, is non corrosive (pumps fittings, gutters and you), is plant friendly and has a high value of "free chlorine" which is the stuff that dose the job.
Hypochlorite as we get it has a PH of around 11 which is very alkaline and at this PH level is the "least effective" in killing moss, mold etc (look at the link chart below) It is, in my opinion very important to adjust the PH level of the mix to a neutral 7.0 to 7.4Ph

Why? I think it will work better, you could use "less" of it plus all of the benifits as mentioned above. No I have not tried it yet, I am just thinking out loud

Please look at this site, it has a pritty chart on it that shows what I am talking about http://www.caromal.co.uk/Resource%20Page%205.HTM remember that the hypochlorite seems to do very little for us where as the "free chlorine" hypochlorous acid is the main killing machine. look at what we have at a Ph of 11.0 (the way it comes) At a pH value of 11 pH, the Free Chlorine exists as 0.03% Hypochlorous Acid (HOCL)and 99.97% Hypochlorite Ion (OCL) it is 99.97% Hypochlorite Ion (this is the least effective and useless part of chlorine) and the good stuff is only 0.03% hmmmm

No one here seems to mention the Ph thing, even the search box only has a few items

Am I wrong about all this?

I also like this page http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=howTo&p=LawnGarden/MaintPool.html there is a table about half way down mentioning common problems, alge, smell etc. it all seems to come back to the PH levels

Cheers

-- Edited by idontknow on Wednesday 16th of December 2009 09:21:01 PM

I am pretty sure the ph and free cholorine is important for the disinfecting attribute, ie in swimming pools/ spas etc., but not for the oxidizing/cleaning that we use it for. Actually, I think the SH works better the higher the ph. I think all roof cleaning products are alkaline based, meaning a high ph.

RCIA Founder

It is good for you guys to be thinking!
Chlorine cleans best at high ph, it is the hypochlorite Ion we are looking for, and it is strongest at high PH.
As far as absorbing chlorine ?
The only way I know of to neutralize salt is water, water, water.
Basically, chlorine is salt, with chlorine attached, sodium hypochlorite, sodium is salt.
How ya gonna neutralize that ?
Water like hell.

Roof Cleaning Toledo Ohio (419) 265-3306 · Guest

Listen to the pro guys, he's been there done that. Water everything down. Then water it down again.

Washed-up · guest

water is a nutrzr of sh...u been using it all along......before during and after

BCRoofClean · Guest

Hey how about a good old fasioned hydrophobic solution.
Like WD-40 it is composed of almost all liquid wax.
That is what is stands for Water Displacement 40.
Ofcourse wet everything down before and after whoch does teh trick anyway I guess. but at least you would be helping out the leaves. No harm in trying
WD-40 is like one of those awesome does-it-alls. You know that it is supposed to be a fish attractant for bait too! And I have personally used it on my bathroom mirror to inhibit fog while running a hot shower.
It, in theory, would repel the Love and you wash it down when you are done. Ofcourse a surfactant is a wetting agent that breaks the surface tension so I guess they might cancel eachother out.
Who knows? it worth a shot. The only cure all clean all I know that is any better is mothers saliva! That stuff cleaned everything. From food stains on your face to bumps and bruises to paint stains....and so on. I wonder if we can bottle that stuff up and use it for roof cleaning! It worked wonders on everything else!

Roof Cleaning North Jersey(908)674-3392 · Guest

BCRoofClean wrote:

Hey how about a good old fasioned hydrophobic solution.
Like WD-40 it is composed of almost all liquid wax.
That is what is stands for Water Displacement 40.
Ofcourse wet everything down before and after whoch does teh trick anyway I guess. but at least you would be helping out the leaves. No harm in trying
WD-40 is like one of those awesome does-it-alls. You know that it is supposed to be a fish attractant for bait too! And I have personally used it on my bathroom mirror to inhibit fog while running a hot shower.
It, in theory, would repel the Love and you wash it down when you are done. Ofcourse a surfactant is a wetting agent that breaks the surface tension so I guess they might cancel eachother out.
Who knows? it worth a shot. The only cure all clean all I know that is any better is mothers saliva! That stuff cleaned everything. From food stains on your face to bumps and bruises to paint stains....and so on. I wonder if we can bottle that stuff up and use it for roof cleaning! It worked wonders on everything else!

Thats nasty.

PTC · Guest

was reading about chlorine neutralizers while back took an hour to find it again thiosulfate is in most pool neutralizers for fish tanks a mix of 10% to 90% water does not kill fish people put drops in glass of tap water to kill cancer compounds sodiun thiosulfate and fulvic acid together make a great plant fertilizer grows and blooms quicker think its a negative ion people take fulvic acid as an anti aging and other medical reasons to do with electrolites if you wash hands with thiosulfate and soap will get rid of smell of chlorine not sure pricing but would be nice to have on truck if you have a spill to neutralize think i got that write

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Dwayne MillerFLORIDAWASH

Lake Marion Citrus & Sumter Counties in Florida

The Roof Cleaning Institute Of America Training & Certification Forum
"Find A Certified Roof Cleaner Directory"

Dwayne Miller
FLORIDAWASH