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Post Info TOPIC: Sodium Hypochlorite STABLE Surfactant For Roof Cleaning


RCIA Founder

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Date: May 25, 2009
Sodium Hypochlorite STABLE Surfactant For Roof Cleaning
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Ok guys, here it is!
I paid a consulting chemist to find this for US!
http://docs.pilotchemical.com/QMS/Technical_Bulletins/Calfax_Talk.pdf

Don't know HOW "expensive" it is, or is not ?
He JUST called me, and I am passing this ON to our roof cleaners.

LOOK at the Bleach Stability Chart ??



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Date: May 25, 2009
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confuseLooks promising, if the cost is lowyawn

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Roof Cleaning Long Island New York (631) 220 6985


RCIA Founder

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Roof Cleaning Long Island New York (631) 220 6985 wrote:

confuseLooks promising, if the cost is lowyawn




YES, if it is affordable ?
Looks like only a small amount is required ?
 

 



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Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Florida

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Date: May 26, 2009
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Thanks for your efforts Chris. Just registered at thier website and requested pricing and a free sample. Looking forward to learning what it costs. Plan to call them in the morning.



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Wash It Clean Restorations

Roof Cleaning Richmond VA 804-687-4960




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Roof Cleaning Long Island New York (631) 220 6985 wrote:

confuseLooks promising, if the cost is lowyawn




Hey, LOOK, they give FREE samples !!!
http://www.pilotchemical.com/webpages/sample_request

ONE of the Calfax Formulations is also an EMULSIFIER biggrin
Meaning it will make the mix THICKEN up smile

Wow, an unconditionally stable powerful surfactant that will also thicken up our roof cleaning mix ??
I LIKE it smile
Hope we can afford it ??
Samples are FREE !!

 



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Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Florida

711 Westbrook

Brandon, FL 33511

813 655 8777

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RCIA Founder

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Date: May 26, 2009
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Roof Cleaning Richmond VA 804-687-4960 wrote:

Thanks for your efforts Chris. Just registered at thier website and requested pricing and a free sample. Looking forward to learning what it costs. Plan to call them in the morning.




GOOD biggrin
I have a trainee in Town, but I plan to order some myself AND talk to a applications engineer ?
LOOK at the several different formulations ?
ONE has emulsification properties biggrin
For the newcomers, this means it will also THICKEN up the roof cleaning mix for less run off, and more dwell time.
Allowing us to use LESS total chemical to clean roofs with !!!
This MAY turn out to be another dead end, like being way too expensive ??
Check PRICES ???
Can't Imagine that, because it is used to formulate commercial products, but ya never know till ya ask ?

 



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Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Florida

711 Westbrook

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813 655 8777

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RCIA Founder

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Date: May 26, 2009
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They make SEVERAL different CalFax Formulations.
Have to see what ones are best/economical for OUR needs ?

 

 

 

 

Calfax

® 10L-45

 

® 10L-45

® 10L-45

® 10L-45 offers low streaking

properties and solubilizes phenolic

germicides in disinfectant formulations.

It provides excellent rinsability.

Glass cleaner,

bath cleaner,

kitchen cleaner,

concrete cleaner,

industrial and

institutional laundry,

pot and pan cleaner,

car wash,

floor cleaner,

hard surface cleaner

Calfax

® 16L-35

 

® 16L-35

® 16L-35

® 16L-35 offers outstanding detergency,

emulsification characteristics and a very

low CMC.

Calfax

® DB-45

 

® DB-45

® DB-45

® DB-45 produces high foam and

extremely stable emulsions in many HI&I

applications. It provides great rinsability.

Diphenyl Oxide

Disulfonic Acids

Diphenyl oxide disulfonic acids offer the same outstanding surfactant characteristics as the neutralized diphenyl oxide

disulfonates, however they have higher activity than the neutralized versions. They can be neutralized with a large variety of

bases for unique HI&I applications.

Product Chemical Name Physical Form/Activity

 

 

Features/Benefits Application

Calfax

 

® 6LA-70

C6 Linear Diphenyl Oxide

Disulfonic Acid

Liquid/72%

Calfax

 

® 6LA-70 utilizes a low carbon chain

which presents excellent hydrotroping

properties and rinses easily from surfaces. Concentrated

home laundry,

glass cleaner,

bath cleaner,

kitchen cleaner,

concrete cleaner,

industrial and

institutional laundry,

pot and pan cleaner,

car wash,

floor cleaner,

hard surface cleaner

Calfax

® 10LA-75

 

® 10LA-75

® 10LA-75

® 10LA-75, when neutralized with

base of choice, produces great detergency

and foaming characteristics in many

HI&I formulations.

Calfax

® DBA-70

 

® DBA-70

® DBA-70

® DBA-70, when neutralized with base

of choice, produces high foam and extremely

stable emulsions in many HI&I formulations.

This information is only for reference. Customers should verify the CFR clearances themselves.

1

 

CFR 21 approved

2

 

FDA approved for topicals

3

 

CFR 9 approved

1 C12 Branched Diphenyl

Oxide Disulfonic Acid

Liquid/71%

Calfax

 

1 C10 Linear Diphenyl Oxide

Disulfonic Acid

Liquid/83%

Calfax

 

1 Sodium C12 Branched

Diphenyl Oxide Disulfonate

Liquid/45%

Calfax

 

1 Sodium C16 Linear Diphenyl

Oxide Disulfonate

Liquid/35%

Calfax

 

Product Chemical Name and Physical Form/Activity Features/Benefits Application1 Sodium C10 Linear Diphenyl

Oxide Disulfonate

Liquid/45%

Calfax

 



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Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Florida

711 Westbrook

Brandon, FL 33511

813 655 8777

See our website here 

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Date: May 26, 2009
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Chris,

I will have my ducks in a row when I call tommorrow. I am reading and reading their website to put together some specific questions based on our applcation and current mix of chemicals. Hope to obtain some PDF docs/info not currently listed on thier website as well as a key contact name/names and pricing. I will post my findings to the forum.

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Wash It Clean Restorations

Roof Cleaning Richmond VA 804-687-4960




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Date: May 26, 2009
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Hello Everyone,

My name is shoaib ( It is pronouned as  Sho-ab or simply Sho) Arif. I have a master degree in chemistry and about 30 years experience working with cleaning products like household cleaners.

Pilot's Calfax surfactants are bleach stable wetting agents and emulsifiers that will help the bleach penetrate into any kind of dirt, oil, grease, fungus etc. One of the best material to add to the bleach particularly Calfax DB-45. Other detergents like dishwash detergent or carwash will bot be bleach stable and will not do the job to it's maximum strength. Calfax will not thicken the bleach, however. For thickening the bleach you can use another material called
Carbopol Aqua SF-1 from Lubrizol (Formerly Noveon). A little caustic will help raise the pH of the formula and that will be the best thing for roof cleaning. So in other words here is a complete formula for roof cleaner.

 

Water to 100%
Sodium Hypochlorite 12.5% 40.0
Calfax DB-45 Piolot Chemicals 5.0
Carbopol Aqua SF-1 Lubrizol 3.0
Sodium Hydroxide 50% solution  to pH 11.0 

Procedure: Add all ingredients in the order listed
with continuous mixing. Mix well after
each ingredient has been completely added
and then for an additional hour after all
ingredients have been added.

Please call me at 513-326-0618 or 513-939-6150 (cell) or E-mail me at sarif@pilotchemical.com if I can be of help.

Thanks for reading. HAPPY ROOF CLEANING !!! Be Careful out there when you are on the roof. Take extra caution and be safe.




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Shoaib Arif


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Date: May 26, 2009
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Got some rough ideas on pricing from Sarif. Both DB-45 and SF-1 are around $13 bucks per gallon. The missing variable is exactly how much product per 100 gallon batch is required to be effective for our application. Sarif has posted a recommendation but feels using smaller quantities may offer effective results and should be experimented with. I have requested samples of both products to play around with. Anyone interested can do the same. Waiting to hear back from the Manufactures Sales Rep for further details on price.



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Wash It Clean Restorations

Roof Cleaning Richmond VA 804-687-4960




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Date: May 26, 2009
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Chris,

Looking pages over. Don't know if I understand completely.Thanks, for your efforts.

M. Inks
Pittsburgh Roof Cleaners

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Date: May 27, 2009
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At $13/gallon, it looks like you would be adding almost $100 to a 100 gallon mix. Has anyone received a price on bulk quantities? At that price and the quantities that Sho was talking about in his post, it would seem impractical.

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Oxford PA 19363
610 842 2104

 

 

 



RCIA Founder

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Date: May 27, 2009
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theroofcleaners wrote:

At $13/gallon, it looks like you would be adding almost $100 to a 100 gallon mix. Has anyone received a price on bulk quantities? At that price and the quantities that Sho was talking about in his post, it would seem impractical.




It is my opinion that many roof cleaners have never experienced the cleaning POWER of a Surfactant.
Here is why.
FEW Surfactats are stable in Bleach.
So EVEN if you buy a Gallon of Dawn or Alax dish soap, it eats up the bleach, OR the Bleach eats up the surfactant!
THINK about what a Gallon of Dawn costs ?
It is my thinking we dont NEED very much of this stuff in our mix ?
I can tell you thyat 1 Gallon of NP 9 Surfactant in 300 gallons of mix is MORE then enough!
The NP 9 Surfactant eats up the Bleach !!


Lets not "close the door" on this stuff ?
I have samples on the way!


 



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Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Florida

711 Westbrook

Brandon, FL 33511

813 655 8777

See our website here 

Click here for more information

Here are more of our services

Watch a short video

 




 



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Date: May 27, 2009
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Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa (813) 655-8777 wrote:

 

theroofcleaners wrote:

At $13/gallon, it looks like you would be adding almost $100 to a 100 gallon mix. Has anyone received a price on bulk quantities? At that price and the quantities that Sho was talking about in his post, it would seem impractical.




It is my opinion that many roof cleaners have never experienced the cleaning POWER of a Surfactant.
Here is why.
FEW Surfactats are stable in Bleach.
So EVEN if you buy a Gallon of Dawn or Alax dish soap, it eats up the bleach, OR the Bleach eats up the surfactant!
THINK about what a Gallon of Dawn costs ?
It is my thinking we dont NEED very much of this stuff in our mix ?
I can tell you thyat 1 Gallon of NP 9 Surfactant in 300 gallons of mix is MORE then enough!
The NP 9 Surfactant eats up the Bleach !!


Lets not "close the door" on this stuff ?
I have samples on the way!


 

I'm not trying to second guess you Chris. Far be it from me to do that! I don't have a hundreth of the experience that you do in this field. If you are talking those types of numbers, it would seem like a no brainer. I was just refering to the post that Sho made earlier. He was referencing using 8 gallons in a 100 gallon mix. I'm still ordering a sample. It is worth a try. After all, we are supposed to work smarter not harder, right?


 



-- Edited by theroofcleaners on Wednesday 27th of May 2009 12:45:17 PM

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The Roof Cleaners llc
Oxford PA 19363
610 842 2104

 

 

 



RCIA Founder

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Date: May 27, 2009
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theroofcleaners wrote:

Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa (813) 655-8777 wrote:

 

theroofcleaners wrote:

At $13/gallon, it looks like you would be adding almost $100 to a 100 gallon mix. Has anyone received a price on bulk quantities? At that price and the quantities that Sho was talking about in his post, it would seem impractical.




It is my opinion that many roof cleaners have never experienced the cleaning POWER of a Surfactant.
Here is why.
FEW Surfactats are stable in Bleach.
So EVEN if you buy a Gallon of Dawn or Alax dish soap, it eats up the bleach, OR the Bleach eats up the surfactant!
THINK about what a Gallon of Dawn costs ?
It is my thinking we dont NEED very much of this stuff in our mix ?
I can tell you thyat 1 Gallon of NP 9 Surfactant in 300 gallons of mix is MORE then enough!
The NP 9 Surfactant eats up the Bleach !!


Lets not "close the door" on this stuff ?
I have samples on the way!


 

I'm not trying to second guess you Chris. Far be it from me to do that! I don't have a hundreth of the experience that you do in this field. If you are talking those types of numbers, it would seem like a no brainer. I was just refering to the post that Sho made earlier. He was referencing using 8 gallons in a 100 gallon mix. I'm still ordering a sample. It is worth a try. After all, we are supposed to work smarter not harder, right?


 



-- Edited by theroofcleaners on Wednesday 27th of May 2009 12:45:17 PM




We will all have to try it, and see ?
I once put 3 gallons of NP 9 Surfactant in 300 gallons of roof cleaning mix.
Result ?
IMPOSSIBLE to rinse!
It took almost a WEEK of thunderstorms to rinse it!
I bet 1 gaLLON pre 100 WILL BE pLEANTY FOR US ?

 



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Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa Florida

711 Westbrook

Brandon, FL 33511

813 655 8777

See our website here 

Click here for more information

Here are more of our services

Watch a short video

 




 



Guest

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Date: Jun 15, 2009
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I am trying to become educated here - haha.  What is a surfactant?  Is there a glossary for some of these terms?



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Date: Jul 20, 2009
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Norm here, a Newbie. Reading and gathering info before I venture out. REALLY appreciate this website and the sharing of info. I've been reading this thread about the 2 different surficants. It doesn't seem like you would need the Calfax because the Apple Cider mixture is sufficient. Has anybody tried the Carbopol as a thickening agent and if so what were the results and ratio used?


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Norm


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Surfactants are wetting agents that lower the surface tension of a liquid, allowing easier spreading, and lower the interfacial tension between two liquids.



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Guest

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Date: Sep 3, 2009
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DID anyone ever get to the bottom of the Calfax DB-45 trials?

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Premium Member Roof Cleaning Institute of America Certified Roof Cleaning Specialist

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Date: Sep 4, 2009
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Wow, this post just kind of died.  Of those of you who ordered samples, how did it work?

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